EOS 50D and Cold Weather

[dashabout]

When shooting my 50D in cold weather, approximately  30F, my metering system fails and my shutter remains open indefinitely. The viewfinder display also indicates  a very long exposure time.   I notified Canon of the problem while under warranty but they said the camera was only specified to work down to 32 degrees and refused to look at it. It's now a year later and i'm not certain what to do next. The problem goes away when the camera is warmed slightly by putting it inside my jacket but I'm shooting wildlife and sometimes need the camera to work in cold temperatures. I've already determined that it's not the battery.   Has anyone had a similar experience?

[Bob Atkins]

I don't really have any advice, but that's not normal. I would have beaten on Canon about it. I know they spec it to 32F and if it failed at 0F they might have a point, but failing at 30F would simply not be acceptable. Now you're out of warranty it may be a bit late though. I'd have escalated the complaint to a supervisor or manager. Sometimes an initial "no" can turn into an "OK" if you beat on them.

All I can suggest would be strapping one of those "hand warmer" or "toe warmer" packets to the body. They last for up to 6 hours and they don't get too hot since they are designed to be worn next to the skin (at least the hand warmers are, I think the toe warmers get hotter because they are designed to be used on the outside of socks). That should work, plus it will keep your hands warm!

See - Hand Warmers

[whizkid]

This is an interesting topic and worthy of greater discussion. Canon and other makers should shed some light as to the whys of their warranty regarding a 32 degree temperture threshold. Some points  I have read  in the past indicate the reason for 32 degrees is due to the liquid in the LCD freezing and cracking the LCD glass. If that is the reason then it would seem simple to alter the liquid. I assume that is what Pentax may have done in their K7 and new K5 as their warranty claims 14 degrees. Furthermore many of the waterproof P&S cameras within the last several years claim 14 degrees. Must be simple and inexpensive to do. On the topic of warming a camera next to your body when a camera has been in the cold may help but what about the potential for forming condensation?

Further. About a year ago I read of an expedition to Antarctica where the author was claiming the party had many cameras along (mostly Canon but several Nikon's). Can't recall the detail but the Canon models experienced a nearly 25% failure rate and IIRC no Nikon's failed inspite of both brands being used in a temperture environment well below their 32 degree claims. Shows they do work in such temps but maybe Canon should do more about this by following the lead of Pentax.

[Bob Atkins]

LCDs don't freeze or crack, but the display does go blank at low temperatures. They're fine again when they warm up.

I guess Canon specify the range over which they test the camera. It's rare for a camera to have problems at low temperatures and many people regularly shoot EOS DSLRs in temperatures well below freezing without encountering any problems (other than shorter battery life).

I don't know if Pentax actually have any different technology or if they just quote a lower number for minimum temperature. Their number may just be closer to the actual operating limit than Canon's more conservative estimate. Could be specsmanship, could be different technology.

Here's an old post by Chuck Westfall of Canon on the subject of low temperature operation:

As noted in the instruction books, the limit for guaranteed low temperature operation with any EOS digital camera is 0 degrees Celsius. However, a lot of people have been successful using our cameras in sub-freezing temperatures, as long as they observe the following precautions against condensation and poor battery performance. Here's some background info on cold weather operation:

SHUTTER LUBRICATION: Older cameras like the Canon F-1 had heavy-duty shutter mechanisms that required special modifications in lubrication for cold weather use. Today's digital SLRs do not require any special lubrication, because their shutters use newer designs with high-performance, lightweight blades and smaller magnets. In terms of shutter performance, no special modifications are necessary for cold-weather use.

CONDENSATION: Even though EOS-1 class digital SLRs are well protected against moisture in the form of rain and snow, etc., they are vulnerable to severe internal damage from condensation, like all other digital cameras. That's the main reason why we recommend placing cameras, including but not limited to EOS Digital SLRs, in airtight plastic bags before bringing them from a cold environment to a significantly warmer one. This allows the condensation to form on the bag, thus protecting the equipment as much as possible.

BATTERY PERFORMANCE: Battery performance drops off as the temperature falls below freezing. Nickel metal hydride and lithium-ion battery packs are better than alkaline batteries in this situation, but even the lithium-ions will eventually stop working once they've chilled long enough. By now, at least one 3rd-party developer (Digital Camera Battery) has produced an external battery that can connect to the EOS-1 class digital SLRs through the supplied DC Coupler, but I don't expect Canon Inc. to either condone this or to make one of their own. In the meantime, the best strategy is to carry a few fully charged spare NP-E3 packs inside your coat, where they can be kept warm and exchanged for the cold batteries from time to time as necessary.

Memory cards are another potential weak link. Canon doesn't make its own, so it's best to check with the card manufacturers and other photographers to get a cold weather rating.

As with current film-based electronic cameras, items such as LCD data displays are the only means available to indicate camera settings such as shutter speeds, apertures, frame count, etc. Digital cameras add another type of LCD for use as a playback monitor. The information normally seen on these displays tends to disappear when temperatures drop below -20 degrees Celsius. LCDs usually start working again when the temperature goes above freezing, but that won't do you much good out in the cold.

Bottom line, it’s certainly possible to use professional digital SLRs in freezing conditions, as long as they are handled correctly. The main issues are condensation and adequate battery power, but with a bit of advance planning these obstacles are not insurmountable.

However, there's not much that can be done with existing technology to ensure consistent digital camera performance in severely cold conditions for the reasons outlined above. You are welcome to try EOS digital SLRs in sub-freezing temps, but keep in mind that you're bound to run into some limitations eventually.

[whizkid]

Good to know LCD's won't freeze and crack. I have read that before but have also read they can. I do wonder why a 32 degree spec is given. Not just Canon but most align to that number. I  know in my years of digital camera use that considerably colder still works so 32 F does seem arbitray.  Canon does go to 14 F with their waterproof P&S D10 so either something is different about it's cold weatrher attributes or they are extending it to keep competitive since 14F is the norm for those cameras.

[Johnf]

I've used my 5DII in the single digits without giving it a thought.  I live north of Boston and go on many snowy hikes in the cold with significant wind.  I don't worry too much about condensation in the winter.  Summer is a different story.  I bag the camera in a zip loc bag when going from AC to the damp warm summer air to minimize condensation build up.  This is one of the disadvantages of a metal body ... it stays cold.

[Johnf]

Dashabout

If you are wedded to the 50D, and you are outside the warrantee, bring it to an authorized Canon repair shop to have it looked at.  A good shop will do a few things.  They may have seen this before and say it is some circuit board or something or other that fails in the cold.  They will charge you a nominal fee to look at the camera, like $25.  Then they will call you before they do the repair and give you a quote less the 25 bucks.  I have had good success.  (n=1) 

Problem is camera repair is expensive.  I brought my camera to Sanford Camera Repair in Arlington MA.  $25 to look at it, $275 to change a circuit board and a fuse and lubricate something (Ocean water + Camera = negative $ in wallet).  They did the repair and it works like new.   They were terrific but I was without my camera for almost 3 weeks!
For a Rebel, that’s 50% the cost of the camera ... still cheaper than a new camera!  For a 50D that’s 25% cost of the camera ... less still.  For a 5DII ... 10%.  Easier to swallow than the thought of a new camera. 

Now, If you have been itching for a new camera and you are a gadget person, now is the time.  (I like my move from xxD to 5DII ... keeps me from buying a new camera every 12 t o18 mo. …  Although I miss 6 fps and 7D AF is looks better than mine!!).   If you decide to buy a replacement, look on e-bay and see what  50D’s are going for,  get a good repair quote and if the repair is lower (accounting for time, shipping etc.) have it repaired and sell it and use the proceeds towards the replacement.

Whatever you do, good luck.

John